BCC's and CTA's

Stuart: Foreign. Welcome to another episode of the book More Show. It's Stuart Bell here and today talking with Betsy Vaughan. Great episode. We're going to dive into back cover copy and call to actions. So we've spoken about this in the past but it ties in nicely with the conversation over the last couple of weeks. Looking at tables of contents and with Dean last week about the email follow up. The back cover copy that you write is very specific in the context of how you're using your book as a tool in as part of a bigger campaign. So two great examples that we do a deep dive on here. If you've ever thought about what, what the best next steps are, how to guide and orchestrate people's thinking into an action rather than just reading for the sake of reading, then this is going to be a great show. So let's dive in. Betsy Vaughan.

Guest: Sure. Belle, how's it going?

Stuart: Very good, thank you. Although today has been a bit of a day full of calls, so I think I'm a little bit hoarse before we start. Do you know what I think so a little bit. And I'm on a different, slightly different microphone today, so if I sound different, it's one of those two things or a combination of both of them. And the fact that on my last call as I was talking to Dave, I don't know if a tiny little fly was flying around the office and I swallowed it but out of nowhere I started choking in the middle of it, slightly embarrassing and I was running around to find some water. So hopefully that won't happen again. What's in the show is in the show, as they say. So.

Guest: Right.

Stuart: Stay tuned to see what happens.

Guest: That's funny. Well, ok, so what are we going to talk about today?

Stuart: Well, we had a good call with Dean last week where we were talking about kind of what to do next once the book is complete, thinking about the email follow ups and the engaging people and flagship broadcasts. So today I wanted to take a step back from that and think about the last thing that happens before they get on the flagship broadcast sequence and that is that they read the back of your book and the call to action. So I think we've talked about it before but not for a while. So I think let's dive into kind of back cover copy and call to actions and what you can do to orchestrate those next steps. That kind of minimum viable commitment that I talk about a lot of the small next step that makes it easy for people to travel down the path that we want them to travel down

Guest: you know, we have spoken about this and we talk about this a lot internally off the show seems like right now quite a bit because people really struggle with the back cover. We hear this almost every single day. There's a, we get our content team. Get that. Oh my gosh. I don't know what I, what I want to put there. I don't, I don't know what that next step is. And I know that you said it at least 10 times over the course of the year. Like, you, like you should know that before you start, you know, before we start the book. Like that should be the, the ultimate, like, what are we going to do with this? Like, how are people going to reach out to us? And, and that's what I say to people. Like, well, you need to have, have that answer. Like that call to action is so important that they have to be able to raise their hand somewhere. You know, if it's just a back of the book with your picture on it though, that's great and wonderful, but

Stuart: it doesn't really do anything.

Guest: No, it doesn't. You want to know what that, you know, if they're going to take an assessment or if you want them to call you or email you or go to my website or whatever. I mean, it's so simple. But yet there seems to be such a struggle with, you know, and I

Stuart: think in part it's because of this idea that we talk about in lots of different contexts is because a book, as a book, when you say the word book, people have a certain thing in mind which is traditionally published books on the shelves of Barnes and Noble. And the job of work of the back cover of the book in that context is to sell the book. It's under the impression that people are kind of browsing through shelves and picking something up and looking at the back and they need something that either convinces or compels them to take that book to the checkout. In the way that we're talking about it. It's not that at all. We've said repeatedly that the book's not the product. In the examples that the funnel that you use in your book, they have the book already. It's not like they'll see the back of a copy before they receive it. So the job of work of the back changes to this funnel based concept. This is one step in a broader process. So using that same space for, as you said, do you want them to call you or come into the office or take an assessment? The back cover copy being the thing that people read Read the second most to the front cover is using that space as the, the place that you can instruct people to take that next step. So the space isn't to promote or sell the book, it's to give them instructions as to, as to what to do next. So I think that's one problem. People kind of necessarily think about that space in the context that we're talking about. They kind of default into traditional book. And then I think the next challenge is that it's easy to get overwhelmed with what that next could be. Next step could be, let alone what it should be, whereas it doesn't necessarily need to be that. There's a couple of frameworks that we've got that make it more straightforward. But the reality is as well is that it's easy to change. Just like the whole 90 minute book process. This isn't writing something that has to be set in stone and can never be changed because we've switched the printing presses off and that's it. This is something that can be tweaked on and improved later as you get feedback from the real world. So I think those are the two challenges that cause people to kind of falter a little bit.

Guest: I do think it is that traditional read book because what I hear when having a conversation a lot is like, oh, I just thought I would put my, my bio on the back of the book. Which was kind of like, I don't even think. I mean, I just pulled a few books off my personal bookshelf just to look. That's really not even a thing. You know, on four books that I picked up, there's little bios, like five sentences, four sentences. That's it. You know, that whole bigger picture. Here I am, this is where I went to college. This is what I've done. Like that. But people, that's one of the first things that people say to me. Oh, I have a bio. It's on my website. You can just use that. Okay, well that's great. They know that you went to University of Michigan and you have three kids and two dogs. I mean like, you know, and you love your wife. So it is kind of a funny, you know, it's kind of funny. But yeah, looking at these books, I actually expected when I picked these books up, two. And these are, these are for some reason three self help books, which may say about me, but it's been a tough year. But you know, even like I'm looking at you are a badass, which is a pretty popular book by Jen Sincero. And it's she even has without like that here, go to my website. It's sort of here's what the book is, this is what it's going to do for you. And she kind of lists without saying step one, step two, step three. Like you're going to identify and change the self sabotaging beliefs and you're going to create a life you totally love and you know you're going to make some, some damn some more damn money is what she says. So there's even, there's even on these books, you know, sort of a call to action about you know, being salesy if you will.

Stuart: Right. And that, yeah definitely a cycle circle back to that before the end. Even those types of books, that genre, the personality driven genre, you'd think that that was the perfect space for a bio. So the fact that people automatically default to thinking that but actually it's very rarely done is another interesting, another interesting insight into where people are thinking about things. So we're saying to people that a bio is not the right thing to put back there. Although I mean occasionally I guess if you've got so much space to or you've only got so much space to work with. So if you get across the main part of the message and then you have a little space left towards the bottom then including a few words about the author, there might be space for it. It's just that's not the first thing to think about and it's not the only thing to think about. Let's think then about what the better steps are. So your book is part of a funnel. It's the perfect early stage, early stage asset to get invisible prospects to raise their hand. So people who may or may not know you already, you may or may not have a relationship with them but you don't necessarily know that they're interested in this subject. A book is very non low commitment way. It's a, it's not non threatening way of having people raise their hand so that you know that they're interested. So the next steps are what, what you would want them to do having read the book. Now the reality is like the last time you and I spoke a couple of weeks ago we were talking about the table of contents and the reality is that read rates on books are very, very low. In fact I think we all said the same thing last week when I was talking to Dean. So read rates are actually low but we know that people want the answer that's being suggested by the title. So they're looking for a solution and they're just then looking for enough supporting evidence and a clear next step to guide them towards the. The outcome. The outcome is not going to come from the book itself. The book isn't going to give them the, the whole solution. Hopefully it gives them enough to kind of make steps in that direction. So knowing that the read rate's low, knowing that they have selected something that they're interested in because of the title, knowing that the table of contents is going to reassure them that they're generally in the right place, then the back cover will wants to ideally be those minimum viable commitment next steps that gives people varying degrees of readiness, gives people a easy next step so that they can continue the journey. Like you said, with the conversations that you have with people who are very unclear on what the back cover copy should be, even at the point that they're really raring to get going on the book and saying that you really need to know where you're going. That's that kind of destination map type analogy of if you just started driving and without a destination in mind, then you're just going to go around in circles for a while until you hopefully end up somewhere. Knowing the destination, knowing what's on the back cover, knowing what you're thinking about that chest master, knowing what the next five, six, seven moves are going to be with this person, you can structure those back cover steps to kind of meet that criteria. So there's a couple of different ways of thinking about it and a couple of different contexts. And it's not always easy to make sure that you cover all of them. So understanding how you're going to use the book allows you to kind of pick the best of the available options. So I think we can dive into those a little bit more.

Guest: I think so. I think when we talked about the low read rate and sometimes, yeah, I think we were thinking about thinking about somebody's cover recently and I'm trying to see if I can find it. So like, I remember I didn't read all of Anthony Princeton's book, but the title of his book is the Woman's Trouble. Trouble Spot Solution, your guide to toning and tightening your problem areas once and for all. And so that tells you exactly what it is, you know, exactly what, what you're doing. So if I never open up inside this book, when I flip over the book, like he's got a nice blurb there about like, you know, how busy women are and how we tend to, you know, take care of ourselves first and, and far as health and fitness and you know, we know we should be better at it and make better choices, but again, it's our priorities tend to be somebody else. And hey, I've helped, you know, hundreds of busy people, like, you know, go to my website here, let's have a call here, email me here, you know, like, it's all right there. I never ever have to open up this book, you know. Right. If that's something I'm really interested in, you know, like, yeah. Oh, wow. This is speaking to me. And I mean, yes, I probably would if I was really interested. I would obviously read the book. But ultimately his, he doesn't necessarily care if you read the book. He wants you to call him and work with him, you know. Yeah.

Stuart: And so that's the outcome. Exactly. And the outcome that you're going to get as someone who's interested in the subject because it's resonated, you've requested a copy of it, you want the outcome. If the outcome is, is a different, a different physical outcome, then really, you know what the answer is? The answer is something to do with eating and something to do with exercise. And in all honesty, you're not going to get that solution from reading the words because you know what the words are already. You're going to get the solution by either a tailored program or specific coaching or being in the gym and getting specific routines. So you know that the next step is to take the next action. And that action is on the back cover. It's not hidden in the pages in between. It's on that, that next, it's the next easy step to get started. It's, it's again, going back to that point of a book has a special place in society. It's a magical and a thing that has some reverence around, carries the message of the next step. And for us, the next step is not in the content, it's in that call to action and what to do next. So let's dive into a couple of the examples then. The first one, which I think I think so. There's no. I always caveat everything, I guess with, with it, it depends. But I guess the two ways of thinking about this is if you're expecting the majority of people reading to know like and trust, you already have some kind of relationship. This book is potentially at the profit activator number three level, the educating and motivating people to take the next step. It's not so much at just getting people that you don't have a relationship with absolutely invisible prospects to raise their hand. Then if you've got a relationship with them already then, and there's some familiarity and awareness with what you're talking about, then the next steps can provide details about a program and then have a single next step towards joining the program here and a place for people to go. So it could be one of the formats that we have that says restate the problem. Most people think it takes like we've got on the 90 minute book. Most people think it takes hours in isolation or days in isolation to write. And it's an arduous process. Actually the process can be quite easy. So step one, we outline for 30 minutes. Step two, we record an interview to get your best thinking out on the subject. And step three, we take it from there and complete all the rest of the program for you. That expectation that people have an understanding, there's a little bit of a warmer relationship. The majority of people who opt into the 90 minute book through that particular channel are coming in because they either have some relationship with us already or with Dean already, or through Strategic Coach or Genius Network, any one of the other organizations where there's some awareness that back cover copy of reinforcing a next step rather than multiple next steps works well because someone has heard us talking about a 90 minute book, they request a copy in the 90 minute book, they know that the COVID is always promising a successful outcome. They flip to the back and there's a clear and easy to understand next step that reinforces just how straightforward the program is. And then there's really one action that they can take which is get started now. Although there's a couple of ways of achieving that. Either go to the website or email us or call us. But still it's one step that works great. Where there's a expectation that people are a little bit warmer, there's an awareness already of you and the thing that you're talking about. And in your mind you're assuming that the majority of people coming through this particular funnel, this particular campaign. So the obvious next step that they want to take is actually to get started. They've really made it to this step because they're one step away from pulling the trigger. So that idea of having something that restates the problem at the top, talks briefly about what a, that there is a solution and then goes into some step one, step two, step three, about how easy and straightforward the solution is to achieve. Perfect for that scenario. The second scenario then is probably, I would say this one probably applies to slightly more people. So this is where we're using a book to identify those invisible prospects. They're people that don't necessarily know like and trust you yet because you don't have a relationship with them. They're people that are very early in the funnel and this is potentially the first time that you've seen them. This might be running Facebook ads to call traffic that don't have a relationship with you already. It might be the complementary non competing business type approach that we've talked about before of offering this book to people who know the person that you're working with but don't necessarily know you. In that scenario, it's better to put steps in there that will identify how people can move forward in the progress in the process rather. So this idea that we talked about of getting to the back cover of the book and knowing what the minimum viable commitment next step is, that small next step to move forward. Then this type of example I'm about to describe is much better for that. This then is looking at presenting them with three ways that they can do something more. So depending on whether they're very early in the process, they're a little bit further in the process and they've got more of a relationship or whether they're ready to pull the trigger and get started in that scenario will typically do things like again, restate the problem at the top because we always want to kind of frame it assuming that someone hasn't read the book. So just there's 200 or so more words, 150 more words to restate what the problem is again, reinforce the fact that there is an answer and then move on to say the best next step is option one, go to the website, check out our videos on this subject where we dive deeper and share some more information with you. Step head over to this particular page on the website or this particular domain and complete either the assessment or the checklist or the scorecard to evidence to yourself that you're in the right place and that there is a path forward. And step three, if you're ready to get started, then the best thing you can do is join this program. Again the kind of mafia offer type thing of making the program that's easy to get started with a low commitment. Make it as straightforward as possible for someone to take that first step with you. But that step three is for those people who are actually ready to move forward. Now

Guest: go ahead.

Stuart: No, no, go for it. And then I'll circle back.

Guest: So I was just, I was, I was just thinking about something you said as far as like assessment. So like I'm looking at something in front of me. And that's a step one, download a free chapter worksheet on our website. And there's the website. Okay, that's great. That's something for people to do. It engages them a little further, you know, they take it and they kind of see whatever XYZ results they're looking for. So just going to the website is just, I mean, it's sort of like, yes, someone's visiting a website, but how important is it to have that, you know, assessment or checklist or something else, you know. Yeah, for them to do once they get there.

Stuart: So the way those three steps, the way that we think about those three steps are the three levels of commitment. And based on that kind of relationship capital that you've acquired with this person over time, they're more likely to do 1, 2 or 3. So for the cold traffic, so this scenario that we're talking about, it's works very well for where you're sending this to cold traffic. You've got no relationship with them so far. Another example of that actually is when you think about Amazon. Amazon, you don't know who these people are. You've got no way of capturing their details. So this is a very good example for anyone that's thinking about listening their book on Amazon particularly. So step one, that just goes to the website. There's no additional opt in. You're not trying to capture any more details. But this is to reinforce the, the know like and trust element of, hey, if you resonate with what you've read already, if you want to learn more about what we're doing, before I actually ask you for anything, like your name and email address or any money, then you can go and check out these resources that we've put together for free. So there's no opt in. This is all about just building more content, presenting them with more content. So it's building more on the relationship. Now again, some people might get overwhelmed with that and thinking, wow, I don't have a whole load of stuff to point people to. The reality is you've probably got something. You might not have much, but you've probably got something out there. And if you don't have anything at all, then it's probably a sign that, hey, it's a good idea to do something in this respect. So it might be like a YouTube channel. You might have shot some videos and put them up on YouTube where you talked about the subject. It might be blog posts that you've got on the site. They don't have to be the most up to date. I mean, if you've got things on there with dates that are listed against the blog post, most website themes, you can hide the date if you don't have kind of recent content on there, but you could point people back to that. It could be something that you specifically write for the book. So in a scenario where you don't have anything, then take the audio of your book. Once the book's complete, just record a new audio. Just talk into your computer or even into your phone and just elaborate on one particular point. Like we've talked before about the email follower sequence. To be able to, on each of those sequences to kind of amplify one of the messages. Just take the extra 20 minutes to record something specific like a fireside chat where you're talking about one element of the book saying, everyone, thanks for joining me today. I just wanted to record this audio because in chapter two we talk about how blue the sky is these days. And really this is a very passionate point that I've got and I just wanted to record this audio to kind of elaborate on that a little bit further and go a bit deeper into why the sky is blue and then just record 10 minutes of you talking about it. If someone is interested in the subject and they want to get something, they want to go deeper, then that's going to be very compelling. It's going to build a relationship with people because they're hearing your voice and it's super easy for you to do because you've effectively done it already. You know what you're talking about. Recording something and then just hosting it on the site is very easy to do. So having that first step as a zero commitment, just providing more content, it's kind of building the building blocks, the foundations of the relationship. Because you want to leverage that relationship a little bit later by asking them to do something. And whether that's just giving them a name and giving you a name and an email address or giving you money, then you're laying the groundwork, the foundations for this capital step 2, then go for it. Sorry.

Guest: So with that, I'm thinking of so much more that you can do with that. Like, hey, if you're, if you're selling your book or you have a great list, your book's been out there, you know, doing something like that 10 minute little blurb, you know, of, hey, we talk about this in the book. That's a great, I mean, not just to have on your website, but if you want to send it out to your Email list. You know, it's a simple. Like you said, it's a simple thing. It's not going to. It's going to cost you a little bit of time. It's very. That's. Yeah, I like that. I. I like people pop in my head like, oh, they should do that. They should do that. People I've been speaking to recently, like, that's a great little thing for me for them to do. So. Yeah. And it doesn't come, like, when you're talking about building that relationship. You know, first of all, they're building a trust because, hey, I've never heard of Joe Schmo, you know, from Kansas. And even though I'm interested in this subject, I almost said Michigan, but I thought, I think I use Michigan already. And I didn't want anybody from Michigan offended by that. So, you know, so I don't know you. I'm going to your website side without being, you know, here, here's something for you to buy my product, buy my service, buy my program, come in and have a meeting with me. You know, blah, blah, blah. There's, you know, giving. Having some valuable content to give people. I think you're so right. Like, people, they're going, oh, you know, I'm getting. I'm getting something that's of value. You know, they're getting something from. From that without having to invest financially. And there is something about the voice, you know, about just hearing their people and hearing a person and sort of, you. You do connect with them on a level and it builds that trust. So I always worry when people start, oh, I want to send them to my website. Well, what are we going to do when we get there? You know, like, you don't want.

Stuart: And honestly. Exactly. And honestly. Without kind of. Yeah. And without throwing everyone in the same bucket. Whenever anyone says, I just want to send them to the website, we. That's a red flag in the sense that you can tell by the. You can almost even tell by the intonation in the voice. It's like, well, I don't want to think about this at all. I'll just chuck them somewhere where there's already there. And for the majority of people, what's already there isn't fit for purpose. It's just something that has been done in the past, potentially been done with the same dismissive answer is, I just want to send them to the website. It might. They might have paid the same attention to creating that thing back whenever. So the additional overhead. And again, I mean, it's a little bit Judgy saying that because that's not always the truth. And it's easy for me to say it because we've got the benefit of it being easy for us to stick websites up. We've got, it's a core competency that we've got internally. So I understand that it's more difficult for other people. But, but there are so many platforms out. Even if, God forbid, you just pointed people to your Facebook page and your Facebook page had. Because it's easy to post stuff to Facebook, there's a million and one of the reasons why that's a terribly bad idea. But without going into that, if you

Guest: have a whole other conversation.

Stuart: Yeah, yeah, exactly. But it's, it's the most easiest, it's the easiest thing to do. So not having a place to put content that is fit for purpose isn't an excuse anymore. And pointing people to old bad content. It's like the conversation. We've done a whole show, if not more than one show in the past about people wanting to repurpose their talks that they've done from stage or webinar that they've done. The problem with it is this fit for purpose conversation. If you just want to use it because it's there and you can't be bothered doing anything else, well, understand that there's a cost to that and that cost is relevancy and fit for purpose. If what's there is absolute true purpose, then hey, do it. But the reality is for most people it's not. So recording something additional that fits in with the funnel fits in with the expectation. Once you've got that asset, that thing as you identified, you can use it in multiple different ways. So we've talked about using audio in the follow up sequence to amplify a point. We'll just use the exact same audio on the back of a copy. I mean it's not. If that's. If those are the best words you've got about that subject, then the fact that you're using it in two different places is perfectly fine because it's the best words. You made the point about it being very engaging. I, when I'm in, in the office down here in Florida, there's a CrossFit gym that I go to every day that I'm down here. And I am almost evangelical about CrossFit. I absolutely love it. My capability doesn't quite keep up with my enthusiasm, but still I'm enthusiastic. The, the, the consumption of additional material then. I've watched lots of CrossFit athletes their YouTube channels. I listen to several podcasts from both athletes and people just who are also passionate about the subject, talking about it. And that engagement really kind of amplifies my interest in the subject. So I'm not just listening to it because it's. It's kind of educational. I'm also listening to it because it's entertaining and it's breadth in the subject and it's depth on individuals, and it's interesting little anecdotes and nuances that don't just come across in. Not really there's a written word equivalent, but. But it's more background and you feel more of a connection with people because. Exactly that. I was talking to someone, and I get back on subject in a second, but I was talking to someone this week, and they quoted back to me something that we'd said in a show a couple of months ago, and I actually missed the reference, so they repeated it to make the point that's where it was coming from, and it was such a weird thing. As a podcast listener then, I'm very familiar with the concept of feeling way more connected with people I've never met, but who I've listened to for 10 years, feeling very close to almost them and their family because of all of the stories that come out in the background.

Guest: Right.

Stuart: I've talked about the immigration challenges we've had over the last couple of years, and the fact that we got married last year and Lucy's up in Philadelphia, and I'm down here every couple of weeks and then back and forth. So anyone that's listened to the show pretty regularly has got a. Some background knowledge. And then to hear that played back or hear some of that played back, it's. It's a little peculiar, but I'm very used to being on the listener end, just not on the.

Guest: Right, right. That is so true. I'm. I'm always taken back a little when someone says, oh, I heard you and Stuart say, and.

Stuart: Right.

Guest: I almost forget, like, okay, this isn't just talking. You know, we actually sent this out to a whole lot of people, you know, so. Yeah, yeah. But it's. But the same thing. When I listen to the podcast, I think I know those people, and I. You almost think, oh, that's my friend. That's my friend Rachel Hollis, you know, all the time, you know, whatever. And so. Yeah. And then. So you. You do. You do pick up that. That engagement. You do, you know, become like, oh, I kind of trust those people. They.

Stuart: Yeah. You know, and because there's an authenticity about it. I mean, it's difficult to be consistently for what we're up to now, like 90 episodes or whatever. It's difficult to just keep that. If this was all fake and false, it would be difficult to keep it going for that long. So anyway, back to the point of the back cover that step one, the job of work of the step one is to build rapport and to allow people to see more content. It isn't necessarily an action step. It's the underlying, it's the foundations that you are putting in because you know it will reap benefits later. In the context of people are seeing these steps and you're not necessarily, you don't necessarily have a relationship already, then it does a great job of work of some of that foundation work. Step two then is the. I'll tell you what, let's jump to step three and then we'll come back to step two. It'll make sense. So step three is for those people who are absolutely ready to go now. So these are people who do know, like and trust you already. They have taken, they have consumed enough to feel comfortable that they want to get started or the commitment is low enough that they're just ready to pull the trigger. So as much as possible, we always want to present an option for those people as well so that whenever they're ready and hopefully they're ready immediately, they can take that step. So this kind of mafia offer that we talk about in the eight profit activators, this way of making it easy for people to get started, having that step presented on the back cover. So this is a perfect match for those people who have requested it because they know this is something they want. They've kind of either read it all or even just thumbed straight to the back and said, okay, well listen, I've raised my hand, I'm interested in this. Just let's cut to the chase and pull the trigger. I want to start this fitness program giving them an easy way of getting started. That is step three. Again, not really rocket science. Usually on the after we've got step one, step two and step three, we've also got some words at the bottom that says alternatively, if you want to reach out to me, I'm always happy to talk about this. So send me an email to joeosmith.com or call me on, on this phone number and we can talk about it. So that's the kind of catch all. Then at the bottom. So then all of that's pretty straightforward. Step two is an interesting one because this is one I think is quite alien to people. It's not something that people necessarily think about and that's having a way of people opting into something that is obviously the next step on the path. So I'm going to use a scorecard as an example, just because we've talked about scorecards before and it's easy to conceptualize and think about. But if you don't have a scorecard, don't worry about it. Substitute. Every time I say scorecard, substitute it for assessment or checklist or reports. It's the thing that is the next level up. It's like the 202 level of engagement. If the book is the 101 level. And bear in mind, I'm from the UK, so we don't have that structure over there. So that might actually be completely incorrect. But I think 101 is the entry level, 202 is the next level up. So if that's correct, it's the 202 level. So let's say for. Let's stick with the scorecard example. So step one, head over to the website or wherever and consume this additional content where we do a deeper dive on stuff. Step three is here's how you can pull the trigger. Step two is head over to bookblueprintscore.com and measure your book idea against the book blueprint mindsets, because that's a great way of schooling yourself on the system and identifying which levers you can kind of pull a little bit harder to squeeze more juice from the book. The reason that we do that is twofold, really, or threefold, I guess. The first one is for those people who are on the list already because they've opted in, they've consumed a bit of the contents, but they still want to evidence to themselves that they're moving in this direction. So those are the people that absolutely go ABCD through the process and not just A TO D. So that's the first purpose. It just allows people to kind of follow the logical progression of a small, minimum viable commitment to move them to the next step. They're going to evidence for themselves where they've got where they're doing well already or where they've got room to improve. And then the call to action after they've taken the assessment down that bit of the funnel really is now. Okay, now it's time to get started. So the first group of people it addresses is those who just want to go ABCD and complete each step in the process. The second group is for those who aren't necessarily they're still in the judging phase, so they may be still not ready. They're six months away from moving, but they just want to take this assessment and they might take the assessment like five times before they actually raise their hand and and pull the trigger on doing something. But still they want that feeling of moving forward and progressing through. So it's actually, even though these people are on your list already, it's giving you an indicator that they're a little bit hotter. So in your CRM system, hopefully you can flag the fact that this person has opted into the book in the first place and then completed the scorecard potentially many times in the second stage. So knowing that information, you can potentially follow up with that person in a slightly different way because you've got some knowledge that they have taken that next step. They're not just the person who opted in and never did anything else, they're the person who opted in and took the next step but for whatever reason hasn't yet completed the got through to the stage of completing. So just gives you some extra information and not just allows you to identify invisible prospects, but identify the hotter ones of the prospects that we're are visible. And the third group, and this one really resonates with or reinforces the Amazon point. The third group is the group that allows you to collect the details of people that you haven't yet been able to collect the details for. So think about Amazon. Someone requests, orders a copy of the book, it arrives, but you don't know who that person is. Having that second stage as a logical progression, but a progression that is behind an opt in means that you can now identify that person in a way that if you didn't have that, imagine that the only steps you had on the back of the book were hey, call me or come into the office. Well, unless that person's ready and with the understanding that you haven't yet built any emotional or reputational, not capacity, capital, sorry, you don't have a relationship yet, then they're not, they're less likely to do that. So having the second step as something that logically makes sense in the progression but also has an opt in allows you to capture those details of that whole group of people that you haven't yet captured their details from. So Amazon is an easy one to think about because it's pretty straightforward. The two ones that are a little bit more subtle are those groups of people who have picked up a copy of the physically picked up a copy of the book from someone else or have been emailed it from someone else. So again, they're not necessarily on your list. And all of the groups of people, sorry. And that might also refer to the kind of complementary, non competing businesses. So we talked about working with a local organization that are similarly aligned to you but aren't competitors and giving them copies of the books to give away. Again, you don't know who those people are. So having this second step that is, that logically makes sense but allows you to capture the details, it facilitates this whole complementary, non competing side. And then the third one I was going to say is from the orchestrating referrals point of view. So again, we talked about this a couple of weeks ago, sending something out to people who are your existing customers and saying, hey, we've just written this new book, would love to get you a copy to give to someone if you know anyone who this would help. Rather than saying to your existing customers, hey, we've just written this book. If you give me the names and email addresses of your closest friends, then I'll send them something which no one wants to do because no one wants to sacrifice their email addresses. So the fact that we're giving them the book, not collecting any details at the first stage, but we have this second call to action which is an opt in then that makes us much more comfortable with having that orchestrated referral strategy because we're happy to give away the copy of the book because we know that in the long term, in the bigger picture, the people who receive that book and want to take a next step, who it resonates with, have a way of doing that because they can opt in to this second stage thing, this minimum viable commitment little step of an assessment or checklist or a scorecard that will help them evidence to themselves that they're in the right place, but doesn't feel like you're just beating the email address out of their friend or their friend sacrificed their email address or they're opting in to get something that they've actually already got. It's a logical progression in the funnel towards making that decision. And that was a lot of words because my voice is very dry.

Guest: Yeah. But I think this is, I think for anybody who is, has been thinking about their book and they're sort of stuck on that. You know, maybe when we ask them that question like, okay, let's talk about your call to action, they won't freeze up. You know, I mean it's, it sort of really breaks it down and I think it makes you, you know, hopefully people will Walk away after listening, thinking, okay, now I need to think of these steps, what are my steps? And then I'm ready to write my book. You know, that's happened from that.

Stuart: But and it's super achievable as well. I mean this orchestrated approach of how to look at the back cover copy, if, if nothing else, I would break it into those two categories. If you're expecting that you're going to use this with people who know, like and trust you already, then have on the back cover the statement, the problem statement again. But don't worry, we're here to help you. Here's how easy it is. Step one, we have a 30 minute call with you to outline it. Step two, we record to get your very best thoughts out. Step three, we take it from there and do all of the production. If that's the criteria, if most people are at that stage, then just simply describe the process, remind them of how easy it is and then give them the next step of how to get started. If you're in a situation where you're using the book in a funnel with people who don't know like and trust you already, so that, that cold prospect type thing, then have these three easy steps. First one, point them to some content where they can just learn more. And if you don't have any of that already, just record something on your phone in the next 20 minutes amplifying one of the points in the book and stick that up somewhere even if it's on Facebook. So just point people to more information. Step two, have an assessment or a checklist or something where people can score themselves and evidence to themselves that they're in the right place. If you don't have anything like that already, then think about as you onboard new clients. People come in through the door every day of the week. What are the five or six questions that you ask them to ascertain whether they're in the right place? So the fitness example, it's do you exercise already? Do you have cravings for food? Do you have a stressful environment at work? Do you have time to dedicate to this? Whether they answer yes or no, then it's almost irrelevant because all you're really doing is trying to engage people in a conversation. So by highlighting those quick things, whatever the questions are that you usually use to onboard people, and then responding to them with a way of saying, okay, well what we typically find is if people score yes, yes, yes to this, then they've got a higher likelihood of having a successful outcome. If they score no no, no, it means something else. So whether or not you've got something already, again, it's very easy to create. And then the last one, step three is here's the easy way of getting started. If you're ready to get going now, then the best step is to do whatever the best step is to do. So I think no need to overthink it. Those two, those two scenarios and the two examples for. And the examples for each of them, very quick and easy way. And it's something that you can always tweak and amend afterwards once you've got real world, real words. Say it for me. Real world feedback right there is

Guest: all right. That is.

Stuart: Yeah, I think that's a good place to stop.

Guest: I think it's a great place to stop. I think that's a lot of valuable information as usual and I look forward to hearing some feedback, you know.

Stuart: Yeah, definitely shoot says yeah, shoot us a reply to this message that comes out or hit up the comments on the blog post, on the podcast post, or even in the Facebook group. And yeah, be interesting to see what people think.

Guest: Yeah, I fluent.

Stuart: Thanks, Betsy. We will talk soon.

Guest: Sounds good. Take care.

Stuart: And there we have it. Another great episode. It's really great to get opportunity to dive deep on some of the subjects like this. The back cover copy in the context of how you're using it is one of those super important things that once you kind of think about the context, it becomes a lot more straightforward. It can be very overwhelming to begin with and it's easy to default to some of the obvious examples. But just that little bit of orchestration, thinking about how you're going to be using the book in the majority of cases really allows you to write something that's more fit for purpose and is going to get you the outcomes that you're looking for. So in the episode there, we talked about the book Blueprint Score Book Blueprint Scorecard and how you can measure your book ideas against the eight mindsets that we have. So if you have, you haven't yet, definitely the best idea to dive into. Bookblueprintscore.com and then you can score yourself against some of these ideas, including things like your table of contents and back cover copy. Some great ideas for you as you complete that. As always, if you're ready to get started, then the quickest way of doing it is to work with us. We can get your book out there and kind of guide you through each step of the process. Process really allowing you just to focus on the content so that's head over to 90minutebooks.com follow the get started links and we'll be there ready to help you through. And if you want to be a show on the show on the guest a guest on the show, then head over to 90minutebooks.com guest shoot me a note with your details and then would love to jump on a show and either talk through your book idea or talk about the book that you've recently written and how you're using it it. So with that we will catch you in the next one.